Forget all the books.
Forget all the endless nights of Dan Kennedy study.
We got Jon Benson on the show to talk copywriting.
And you’re about to learn a TON.
Jon’s THE Video Sales Letter Guy..
..he invented them.
And in the process,
…he’s etched himself onto many favorite-copywriter lists.
So today, Jon’s talking copy.
He’ll tell you how to compel people with truths so ridiculous, they NEED your product.
He’ll show you how to strike people at their core with your copy,
..no matter what your industry is or who you’re writing for.
Start making more money now with Jon’s insights.
He throws out gold.
Pure gold examples, real time,
..of various situations,
And how he would write within each.
Jon’s entertaining, smart, and a damn good copywriter.
Chances are you’ll be hitting pause or 15 second rewind many times for this one.
Podcast: Download (Duration: 31:14 — 25.2MB)
In this episode, you’ll discover:
- the compelling versus convincing technique you should always use in your copy (litigators use it to convince juries)
- the 4 Quadrants of Desire nurturing tactic that will break your readers’ hearts
- how to take any problem out there… and make it catastrophically big (make people walk away needing your solution)
- the burden of consciousness strategy that hooks people into whatever you’re saying (does fear drive sales? Yup)
- how agreeing with someone is just like pulling an Aikido or Judo move on an attacker (don’t worry, it relates to copywriting)
- the XYZ Principle that builds instant rapport and will impress whoever you talk to
- don’t be a superhuman copywriter, be a super-relatable one and sales will come
- how Shakespeare would make a horrible copywriter
- how aggravation can be the best persuasion tool you never knew you had
Intro and outro backing music: Forever More by CREO
John McIntyre: Hey, it’s John McIntyre here, the Autoresponder Guy, and it’s time for episode 82 of the McMethod E-mail Marketing Podcast, where you’ll discover one simple thing, how to make more money every time you send an e-mail to your list. But you know what? I’ve really been thinking that, uh, this podcast is sort of that email marketing but really I just think it’s about business and marketing and how to really get more customers and make more money so you can just have more fun with life, whatever that means to you. So, uh, I think as this podcast moves forward it’s going to head more in that direction, and with some more of the, uh, general marketing focus. Still the email twist, with uh, with me getting on here with the radio voice, but, uh, thinking of broadening out a little bit.
Anyway today we are talking to John Benson. Now John… man I’m pumped to have him on the show. He’s the creator of the “ugly video sales letter”. So he’s the guy responsible for all those PowerPoints, you know, those video sales letters that have, you know, there’s a PowerPoint with black text on a white screen and it just cycles through with the voice going over the top. He’s the one responsible for starting that trend in, uh, in online marketing, as far as I’m aware. Now today we’re going to talk about some of that, but also about some of the stuff he’s been doing lately, which is, rapport building stuff, like, he calls it “agreeance”, which is getting sort-of like an emotional buy-in. With the way you write copy you can get someone to emotionally buy-in to your message, so that when you present your offer they’re much more likely to take you up on it.
To get the show notes for this episode of the email marketing podcast go to TheMcmethod.com/82. Now, I’ve got a McMaster’s insight of the week. There’s a question; I had dinner with a very interesting character a couple nights ago, very successful, very wealthy. He’s not in, in marketing or anything like that but, his advice, when we’re chatting about clients and chatting about sales and he goes; Look, the single most powerful question you can say to someone when you’re trying to get their business it’s not, well, it’s not your pitch, it’s not asking them all about their business, going into real specifics, just say to them, “How can I get your business, you know, what do I have to do today to get your business?” Because here’s what’s gonna happen when you’re trying to pitch someone; you’re gonna go in, your gonna give them the pitch and they’re gonna go… yes or no. Maybe they’ll say yes, great, but lets forget about those. The ones that say no, there’s a reason they’re saying no, ok. The quickest way to get to the heart of the matter of why they’re saying no, just say, “Look, what do I have to do to get your business?” Maybe they’re gonna tell you that the price is too high, ok, maybe they’re gonna tell you that, uh, that another provider is offering them a bit more than you, and then you can just make a decision whether you want to match that offer or not. Ok? It just cuts the heart of the matter so fast. Whether or not you decide to match, you know, accept it, it’s still a very good question. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha ok? So that’s it for now, now if you want more insights like this you should join McMasters. McMasters is like a private business community there is a bunch of products in there on email marketing, and also just on how to build your sales funnel and get more customers for your business and if you want to learn more about that just go to www.themcmethod.com/mcmasters, and you’ll learn all about that over there. Now, let’s get into this interview with Mr. Jon Benson.
It’s John McIntyre here, the auto-responder guy. I’m here with John Benson. Now, uh, you might have heard of John Benson before, he is the creator of the “ugly video sales letter” he’s got a course that teaches you how to sort of, uh, make those sales letters with the PowerPoints and the screen flow and all of that, and, uh, also the psychology behind that. Why it works, why, uh, why they’re so effective and why you see them all over the internet now. So I thought I’d get him on the show and we’d talk about, not so much, not specifically the video stuff, but some of the core psychological tactics and strategies underlying the video stuff. Cause now John’s working on, um, we’ve got a copyrighting thing. I think it’s a product or a software, so it’s all about, it’s not just about videos it’s all really just persuasion and how to get someone to, uh, buy your product or buy your service. So we’re gonna talk about some of that rapport and the psychological stuff underlying all of that. So we’ll get into that in just a minute. Jon, How you going mate?
Jon Benson: I’m good John, How’re you man?
John McIntyre: Fantastic, man. So before we get into some of that rapport building stuff can you give the, uh, the listener a bit of a, I’m sure, I’m sure he’s probably heard of you but, uh, just in case he hasn’t can you give him a quick background on who you are and what you do?
Jon Benson: Ahh, sure, most people know me as the guy that started video sales letters, uh, that’s, that’s true, um… the guy that taught Ryan Dice and all those guys and has written a lot of copy. I didn’t start off as a copy writer, I actually started off as a fitness marketer, and, uh, my first book did real well but I had someone else write the copy for it and it cost me half the product, so… I just determined that I had to figure out how to write copy somehow, and I really struggled with it I decided to create an “ugly sales video letter.” Which, I didn’t’ say I’m going to create an “ugly video sales letter” I just happened to put words over a video that I had shot, that I didn’t want to shoot cause I just didn’t, it was a fitness video and I didn’t, I didn’t look my best. So, it was like, you know, I don’t wanna, I’m unshaven and all this stuff and I’m thinking, yeah it’d probably be better if I just don’t, if I’m not live in this one and just ended up putting words over the, words just to my voice and, uh, that ended up like sextupling the conversions I normally received from that. So, that led to me doing it for my, for the sales letter that I did and that ended up, within a month, having a, you know, a million dollars a month in traffic being spent on it because the conversions were just out, out the roof and that led to me writing the one for Mike Gary. That was the second one that was written, and then, then me writing the one for, um, pimslur and it kind of went on from there and I kind of accidently stumbled into a career as a copywriter and now I’m known as one of the better copywriters out there, which is flattering and, uh, I’m in that circle but, I don’t write copy for other people anymore. I have a team that does that and I just kind of copy my thing and my thing is the copy accelerator, which is my course that teaches people how to do this, because I’ll tell you right now, unless you get a pro on your side or if your naturally good at it great, but most people aren’t and most sales pages suck, so it’s that simple. So, yeah, so that’s really, that’s me in a nutshell. Somebody that can help someone’s sales pages, you know.
John McIntyre: I like it man. It’s kinda cool, like, it’s funny how, like, everyone comes into this world in sort of like a different way. Like sometimes people fall into it, sometimes they go into it thinking I’m gonna be an internet millionaire. It’s, it’s always curious, or interesting to see how its…
John Benson: Yeah, I wanted to be an internet millionaire. I did real well with my first book, but, uh, the thing is that never happened until I got copy. Until I got sales copy and in my case I got lucky with, you know, video sales letters weren’t, there wasn’t anyone around to compete against in that mode for about six or seven months and after that I taught Ryan Dice how to do it and he came out with a product about it and, uh, it just went nuts from there and his product was just a very cursory, very simple look at how to do it but, um, it was enough to get the more advanced marketers that already understood copy, it got guys like Agorra and other big companies doing it and then I consulted with Agorra and a lot of other companies to kind of tweak things further but the point is, is that, yeah, unless you’ve got badass copy on your side you might as well just forget about it. I mean throw traffic at a crappy page and you’re just going to get more crappy results, it’s just, the bottom line is most of your time in a day should be spent on copy. In this case you can either have somebody that’s already done it and proved it, and put it into a system that’s made over a billion dollars for people or you can try and figure it out on your own. It’s up to you but you need to figure it out.
John McIntyre: I’m curious, how did you end up learning copy? If you sort of fell into it did you sort of sit down with your fitness business and, uh, like make a conscious decision to go, I’m gonna go and learn copy, you go read the books and look at old sales letters and all of that stuff or did you just have a natural aptitude for it?
John Benson: Okay. This is going to sound really cocky and its, but its, not meant to be, its, there’s no bullshit here. I never read a single book, I never looked, I never read a sales page. I never did anything. I never really studied any serious copywriting at all until after I was established as a copywriter and then I did, and one of the reasons I didn’t want to do that is, uh, I wanted to create something new. I always had this ambition in my life to, if I could, if I wanted to do a book it would be something no-ones done before. Which, my first book was unique and, uh, if I write copy for a sales page I’d like it to have my own voice to it, I don’t want it to sound like everyone else, and I was a good writer, I just wasn’t a good copywriter. It was two different things, totally. You don’t have to be a good writer to be a good copywriter. You really don’t, I mean it helps, you could write some really awesome stories but, uh, there’s formulas for that too that I created but what really ended up being the case for me was, I just dove into.. I’m gonna try and write my page myself and it was disastrous to be honest, and so I said, I’m just gonna put it all into a video sales letter, and when I did the copy on the page changed, it was like it didn’t make sense anymore with me talking the way that it made sense when someone was reading it and that’s one of the key differentials between sales pages and video sales letters is, uh, when I was talking it felt silly not going into a rapport, and that’s what we’re going to talk about tonight, it felt really stupid as a matter of fact. To talk like a sales page felt stupid. But, to talk like a conversation and I’m talking to one person and I, uh, and building rapport by telling a, what I call, and I’m telling a personal story in this case and going from there. That ended up being the real gem of this thing. There’s certain things you can do in a video sales letter that’s impossible to do on a sales page. I think you need both, don’t get me wrong. To actually say that sales pages are dead, they’re not. You just, you need both and you need them to interact together which is what we teach people to do but without a video sales letter you’re shooting yourself in the foot.
John McIntyre: Yeah, Absolutely. Alright man, well let’s talk about some of that…
John Benson: Hang on, I think I lost you John…
John McIntyre: Are you there?
John Benson: Ok. Yeah we cut out for a second there. Yeah, we’re back.
John McIntyre: Alright, let’s get into some of this rapport building stuff man. You talked about, um, let’s sort of take like a big picture look at what’s rapport and why does it matter, then we can drill down into some of the stuff you can do in videos and sales letters, and all that to make it happen.
John Benson: Yeah, so rapport is basically the idea that you have to substantiate yourself without… as a real human being to somebody that’s a total stranger on your site, which is much more difficult to do on a sales page than it is on a video sales letter. Um, and a lot of people think that it’s easier to do with, like, live video but the problem with live video is that people are looking at you and their not listening to what you’re saying.
So, they’re looking at you and I found this out the hard way, they’re looking at you and leaving comments like, oh, I think you’re really cute, ewww your nose is big, oh your hair is goofy. Whatever the case may be, it could be anything right, I mean how many times have you gone to a website and it’s a beautiful woman talking and your like, what did she say? I lost you about ten mili-seconds after you got started. That’s the problem with videos you know, it’s a double edged sword there. So, video sales letters remove that and create this really hypnotic effect by listening to a voice and just seeing the words on the screen. It’s almost like you can’t help but read those because it’s going by, it’s going by rather quickly. So, in that sense you want to build rapport by first of all establishing the fact that you’re just, you’re a lot like the person that you’re talking to. Maybe you’re a few steps up the ladder, maybe your ten steps up the ladder but you used to be like them. In fact it’s even better when you can say I used to be probably a lot worse than you are.
So that’s one of the common rapport based strategies but the two I wanted to talk about tonight, that most people haven’t heard of, except that have gone through some of the more advanced training I have, is called the yes reflex. In other words, getting a yes by reflexive nature instead of coercing a yes. Instead of feeling like somebody’s twisting their arm you have to actually compel them to say yes because they’ve already said yes to things they already agree too over and over and over again. It’s like micro commitments but it’s on a much deeper level than just saying; how many people in the room want to make more money and they raise their hand. That’s one way of saying yes from a stage. What I’m doing is getting people to agree to things that you know they already believe in. If you have a profile of a person that hitting your site, you have a basic understanding of what their core values are, and the more you relate to their core values and talk about like, you say, say I know your probably a lot like me and you believe that family and friends that are very important to you, in fact, I bet that you would go so far as to say they are one of the most important things in your life. Well, did you know that when you carry extra weight, it’s a burden on your family, and you may not feel like you’re being a burden on your family right now but ex cetera, ex cetera.
So, I’m getting them to agree to something and then I’m telling them something that would be shocking, if taken in that context. Most people don’t think of, like of losing weight as being a bad parent but in a video sales letter I will take them down a road from a bad parent to a financial failure and down the line without coming out and saying those words in such a harsh way. The only way you can do that is by, first of all working within a rapport structure and second of all taking away the no response.
So, here’s the deal; when you’re a child you hear no something to the tune of 700 times more than you heard yes. Um, it’s just, if you have a kid or you know people with kids, I mean how many times do they say no to their kid? It’s, we have a dog right, we have a puppy and we say no to Titan like 57 billion times in a day versus… We actually don’t say no, we say “enhh” of whatever. So it’s the same basic thing you know, leave it, so that’s the same thing we do with a child. The only difference is the child, their subconscious mind is imprinting this over and over and over again and that leads you into your life, and a lot of people say no to things that they know are good for them like how many people, for yourself, how many things do you know that are really good for you, I mean without one shadow of a doubt that you’d say no to. Whether, it could be working out, eating right, um, saving money, whatever the case may be right. There’s nothing harmful about any of those things yet we reject them.
John McIntyre: I’m wondering if this is, is this part of the pitch or this is explaining it, it’s just like, cause this would work as part of a pitch just talking about this “no” thing. You’ve got to say yes to your life.
Jon Benson: Well it very well could, yeah. This is not a pitch, this is actually what we’re doing underneath the surface, so, uh, we’re not doing Tony Robbins; “you gotta say yes to your life!” This is what we’re doing, we’re getting people to understand in a very subtle way that they’ve said no so many times to various components of, I’ll take weight loss as an example, this could work in any field at all, it doesn’t have to be weight loss of course it’s just one that I know well.
But, people have said no to I’m not gonna be healthy I am not gonna be fit. I am not, and they are saying no to things and they are saying I am not going to exercise, I am not, and they know that they want to be fit and they know that exercise is not traumatically terrible and yet they are saying no to it and the reason they are saying no to it is because those engrams that are just imprinted into the brain from the time they were a child and they’ve gotten linked up, there’s some weird connections going on there. So, the way to disconnect that and get a yes reflex out of people is to agree with them.
We talked about “agreeance” when we first got on the call, agreeing with somebody is the best way to completely take them off their game. It’s like an akito move, if you’re familiar with the martial art, ok, well, in akito you actually move toward the attacker. In judo and other grappling arts you do as well, so you move directly toward them, so somebody’s swinging a punch at you your natural reaction is to step back. Well, in Akito and other martial arts you actually walk right into them, ok. What does that do to their energy? It totally dissipates that energy and then you have total control. It’s the same thing when your agreeing with somebody, that’s saying, and you know what they’re saying because you’ve just gone through a profile that’s very simple profile that you fill out saying what are my customers, what are their paying points. What are the things that they have tried and failed at? What are the things that they would love to see done, right? Um, so, um, in a video sales letter for a weight loss product I’ll say, you know, you’ve probably heard that dieting is difficult and if you’ve ever tried it you probably know for a fact that dieting is really a challenge. Your right. It is a challenge. It’s really difficult, and the reason why is it’s a challenge is the reason why you don’t see very many fit people around. But let me give you this, this is something totally new and what I’ve done is realized first of all yes is a challenge for so many people and it was a challenge for me in a major way, what can I do to lessen that challenge, and actually make it somewhat easy. So, all I’ve done is just simply agree with them that it is a challenge, I’m rattling this up inside my head, and change the tone of that to what if it could be easy? Yes, I know it’s a challenge but what if it could be easy.
So, you’ve agreed with them. Yes, you’ve probably gone through one diet after another. You probably consider yourself even a failure, and I hate to use that word, but maybe you’ve said that to yourself and you just got really frustrated, and they’re shaking their head yes, yes, right and guess what the only reason why that has been a struggle and continues to be a struggle for so many people is they don’t know the xyz principle. The xyz principle is what makes this easier and then they’re open to it because you have agreed with them that it’s hard. So, this is building rapport.
Because when you agree with somebody, and anybody knows this when you meet, when you talk face to face, if you sit there, if you go “So tell me about yourself.” Oh I’m in politics.” Oh, I love politics, that’s awesome, yeah, that you just immediately, either, if you’re not, if the guys not a douche, you immediately kind of like this guy. Your like, oh, yeah, politics is cool, I really dig it, yeah… well I’m into so and so… yeah? Yeah, me too. So, this is very common sense when you’re dating, your picking up girls or doing whatever you’re doing, meeting a person and trying to impress them. Copywriters don’t use this, they don’t use this agreeance principle.
John McIntyre: This reminds me of the, feel, felt fan thing that people use in face to face and you’re really just acknowledging someone or what they think or what they believe and then acknowledging their belief and then saying, “but, hey, it doesn’t have to be that way if you said xyz formula, whatever it happens to be.
Jon Benson: Exactly, exactly. So, it’s acknowledging their belief at the same time it’s acknowledging that what they think is actually true, if it is true. So, for example, dieting is difficult. So I say, you know, dieting can be one of the most difficult things anyone ever does. Especially if you do it like you’ve been taught over and over again. So don’t blame yourself if it was difficult because I understand it was difficult. You know, and so, all I’m doing is historically agreeing with them there, but I’m saying, however things are done a little bit differently over here in this part of the woods, so, um, and that’s a way to get someone to go “oh, really?” So, you’ve disarmed them. If you come right out to somebody and go, “You know what? Making money is easy.” They’re gonna go, “Fuck you, I don’t believe a word your saying because I’m poor and I don’t have jack.” So it’s the stupidest thing to ever say, you would never say that, ever. But you hear this all the time in copy, it’s like, “how I made 57 million dollars the easy way.” It’s like, no-one believes that.
John McIntyre: Yeah, another example of that is you get like guys getting on stage telling stories, like entrepreneurial kind of guys, they’re selling some sort of make money… it could be online it could be real estate and they tell a story about how they’ve been an entrepreneur since they were like 13 years old and I realized one day that pretty much, there’s probably like 1% of people in the audience that could relate to that story. Everyone else is thinking, “well, I was not an entrepreneur when I was 13 so how the hell am I going to do what you just did?”
Jon Benson: Exactly, anything that you state that takes you out of rapport and makes you something super-human is going to ruin sales. So, here’s what you can’t do, I’m pretty much against lying in copy, so you can’t say, “I grew up in a wet rolled up newspaper, and I have no schooling at all. I can’t even spell or speak but still I managed to make millions of dollars.” So, that’s not true, right? Although I know guys that have done that.
John McIntyre: It’s true for some things.
John Benson: The lying tactic is what I call it.
John McIntyre: Ok.
John Benson: But what you can do is like, somebody like, you ask me… “Do you just have a natural knack for this?” And somebody could argue, and I could make a pretty good argument that I probably did because I didn’t study it. But what I do instead is say, “I did have a knack for writing but what I found out was writing and copywriting are nor remotely the same. In fact, copywriting breaks every grammatical rule you can think of. Copywriting requires no eloquence of writing what-so-ever. It doesn’t require you to be Tolstoy or Shakespeare at all, in fact Tolstoy and Shakespeare would suck as copywriters. So, if you’re worried about being an artist and a copywriter, differentiate those two right there. So, that’s one way I might say it and, uh, then I would say something like, you know, I figured this out by just going back and doing a lot of reading in psychology and I was a psychology minor, so I just went back and re-read all these books, and you know what? I did it so you don’t have to. So, right there, just saying “I did the hard work so you don’t have to.”
So, if there is something, like, well I don’t have a minor in psychology or a major in philosophy and I don’t understand the rules of logic, I don’t say that.
I say, “Yeah, that true. So you don’t have to.” That right there builds back rapport, so, the whole thing is… if you stay in a state of rapport the entire way through, then when you do make what I call a super-hero comment, and you do it in, in, and there’s a section in our accelerator that talks about a modest introduction, and then when you introduce yourself for real, the way that you modestly introduce yourself is you can say, you know, “I was not always considered the best copywriter in the world, in fact, that’s kind of ridiculous for me to even say right now, in fact, I used to suck at copy. I was terrible. I had no natural skills for this what-so-ever. My first 4 sales pages bombed, it was unbelievably bad.”
So, all I did was, in the very first of that I said… “Now, I wasn’t always known as the best copywriter in the world and certainly not the best teacher of copywriting in the world. In fact, so all I do is I don’t say… “I’m John Benson, I’m the best copywriter in the world.” It’s a douche kind of thing to say and, you know, whatever, you can say like “I’m John Benson and I created the video sales letter.” That’s a factual statement, ok, um, or I created the “ugly video sales letter”, that’s a factual statement. But you could say, and that “ugly video sales letter” has gone on to make other people over a billion dollars. That’s a factual statement. But, I haven’t said anything about me other than I started this thing. So, but that doesn’t, they’re wanting me to say that. In other words they’re wanting to talk to the guy that started something so that they can learn what it is.
But if I start talking about the stuff they have to do… because they don’t have to create the video sales letter right? They have to actually create one for themselves. If I start talking about in either way, like look this is so easy a monkey could do it, you don’t need any training at all anyone can do this. They’re gonna shake their head. “No way, I’ve tried it and it didn’t work.” Or “No, I just don’t think I can do it.” At the same time if you say “look, this is super complicated.” Then you’re gonna lose your rapport there. So, what I do is say, “Listen, if you had to remember all stuff that I spent years and years studying, your head would probably explode. Not because you’re not smart enough but because you’re running your business, right, you’ve got your own business and that’s where your smarts go. You don’t need to be worrying about this other stuff, let me worry about that for you. Follow these steps. Yeah you’re gonna roll up your sleeves and you’re gonna do a little bit of work but every good thing has work in it. In fact, you know how many times you’ve been sold a bag of lies and somebody telling you something is cheap or easy or whatever and you know that’s not true, you know that and I know that and I know that you’re smart enough to know that too.”
So I’m speaking in copy, so I’m agreeing with them and at the same time I’m telling them, “Don’t think that this is like push a button and out pops a million dollar sales video. It’s the next best thing to it.” So that the thing, and these are all rapport tactics, and they’re all geared to, like I said, to trigger a yes reflex. And let me talk about this one last then and then I’ll get off the subject, it’s the concept of compelling versus convincing.
John McIntyre: Ok.
John Benson: So I looked at litigators to come up with this model and litigators that are really skillful, here’s how they do it… here’s how they convince a jury, right or wrong by the way. They convince the jury by merely letting them agree over and over and over again with the deep stuff they already believe in. Then what they do is they link that deep stuff that they already believe in to the person they’re defending. They do it in a very subtle way. Its anchoring, its classic anchoring but, this is what you need to do.
So if you’re talking, and this is so weird, if you’re talking about like making money online, right? So this is stuff you normally don’t hear about making money online, well you do with good copy but, you say; “If you’re anything like me you value your freedom and you value your family and you probably have this little bitty voice that’s inside your head that says ‘I don’t want to be a failure. I don’t want to be embarrassed in front of my friends because I tried this crazy internet marketing thing.’ If you’re feeling that, you’re just, you’re honestly, you and I are like brothers because I completely get it, you know, I completely understand I had the same feelings myself. The good news is that blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.”
So all I’m doing again is I’m, I did the same thing there with the whole rapport building tactic, but I anchored these very deep emotions. The feelings of acceptance, uh, the feelings of family and friends. Those kind of things came out in that sentence.
John McIntyre: It’s very nurturing. It’s a bit like, you know, when you talk to your
mom or maybe a wife or a girlfriend. You really have that nurturing kind of interaction that they listen and validate. I think women are very good at this kind of stuff.
John Benson: Yeah, yeah. Validation, it’s huge. It’s known in psychology and it’s
known, and that’s one of the reasons why I think I did have a knack for it.
John McIntyre: It’s like you’re a counselor to the, uh, the reader or the listener.
You’ve really got to capture them all.
John Benson: Yeah, yeah you do. I’m all for what I call the “quadrants of desire”.
You have to do it in all 4 quadrants. So what I’m doing right now is talking about, uh, there’s fear. Fear of not being excepted, there’s the fear of being considered a failure and those kinds of things. But you have to do it in the other quadrants as well. In some of them you can be right in their face, so that’s great. It’s just a whole dynamic here, you know, it’s not all just like, everything’s feel good. Like for example the big section in my five step formula for video sales letters, there’s a whole thing called the big problem and I take your problem and I can take any problem and I can make it really catastrophically big. Like you can say I, you know, I don’t, like you could say for example, “you know what I need a better gun. Um, my gun it’s kind of misfiring sometimes so I can’t hit the target as well as I used to but it’s no big deal, I need a better gun.” And you’re on my better gun site right? And I’ll say, “You know you probably have a problem right now and that you probably want a better gun. Maybe its misfiring maybe it’s doing these things. Did you know it’s actually probably a bit worse than that? Do you realize that your gun could actually be the one thing that saves your life in a critical moment? In fact they say that it takes a half second to respond to a critical moment and if your gun doesn’t fire right you could lose the life of your loved one. So this isn’t about target practice. This is about maintaining the safety of your family, and did you know that most children that injure themselves with guns do so”… and I’m making this up cause I don’t know a lot about it but you get the idea.
I would make your problem really big. So you’d walk away from this thinking, “Wow, I’ve got to do something about this because I believe in, I love my family and I love my girlfriend, I love my…” You know, and that’s getting you to agree with it.
John McIntyre: Right, right, this is like classic copywriting. I just did some stuff for
the community where I’ve got, I made the point, you know, you get someone’s’ attention. You ask them a question about the problem or talk about the problem in some way and then you don’t really force them to do anything. It’s not even really about persuading them to do something, it’s more about just aggravating the crap… making that problem that they have so big that they naturally want to take the next step. And when you say, “By the way, if you want to protect your family, if you want to get a new gun, just click this link and I’ll send you one tomorrow.
John Benson: Right, exactly. And then it comes down to what I call the grand
offer. The offer has to be irresistible and big, but, but yeah, so if your solution is, the bigger solution is what I call it, is bigger than the problem. So it not only solves the problem with this it solves the problem with this, that, and the other. They don’t know that they have this, that, and the other when they hit the site, that’s the whole thing. They may feel it on some obscure level but someone that needs to lose weight has no idea they are being a shitty parent and instilling their RNA into their next child, who will also be a food addict. You’ve got that burden of conscious to deal with, and you know, you can go down the line.
If I know I’m going to a predominantly white conservative audience I’ll throw in, I’ll thrown in biblical stuff like; your body is your temple and let’s face it, stuffing your navel full of sugar and grains is probably not the best idea, you know. So, I mean you can, I mean that’s just ultimate persuasion. So, yeah that’s not a good idea at all. So, but, I’m not saying anything that isn’t true. I’m just stating, there’s nothing I’ve said that isn’t true at all and that’s the thing I wanted to get across. I’m not lying, I’m not even exaggerating, I’m compelling them.
John McIntyre: Your motivating them, your kind of an inspirational speaker in that
sense that, this is why you’ve got to have a great product, you know you’ll be ethical about it you know. People have limiting beliefs about, you know, I can’t lose weight or I can’t, you know, or I’m not good enough to help my family and our job as marketers is to empower them and that’s really where all this persuasion comes in and we empower them to go solve those problems for themselves. So I think it’s like a duty that we all have.
John Benson: Yep, it is a duty. I think it’s an ethical duty too. Because I mean if
you have a product that you know works, you need to sell it to the best possible ability that you have. Ethically, honestly, but with the best possible ability that you have and if you’re half-assing copy then you’re actually being unethical. Cause that means being impure to people that you can help.
John McIntyre: Absolutely, well cool man. This has been, this has been fantastic.
Before we go though, if someone wants to learn more about this. I know you’ve got the 3 accelerators, tell the listener a bit about that. So they can go to sort of, learn more about it or purchase it if they would like to.
John Benson: Yeah, cool, so accelerator.com, it’s, um, and it does exactly what it
sounds like, it accelerates your sales. So that’s where you would go and it’s a combination of a course that is built into software that is online, nothing you download. It literally spits out copy for you and it’s copy that I’ve written. So it’s copy I’ve written over the course of many, many years, doing the top video sales letters in the world. I’m taking the copy that I know works and I’m putting it into a format that anyone can use, and what’s really interesting about it that it, uh, comes out very unique because inside each slide I give you a little video that you can watch. Here’s how you personalize this, here’s how you make it a little bit different, and so many people have gone through accelerator and spit out, like, multi-million dollar videos. So, there’s so many letters I’ve kind of lost count, and even the ones that don’t do that, they take their sales page from making 10 sales a day to making 50 sales in a day.
They make a big difference in part time income or whether you want to be a professional internet marketer. So the key thing is, it’s not turning you into a copywriter that loves to do this, right, but most people in here are not copywriters, they’re business owners and they don’t want to be copywriters. So let me be the copywriter and let you point and click and watch videos and let me do 90% of the hard labor for you. Yes, you’re going to have to do the other 10% of the labor, I’m so freaking sorry, you’re gonna have to do something. You’re going to have to actually work for this or you can peg out 100,000 dollars for me to do it for you. If I still did it, but I don’t. So, it’s a lot cheaper than 100,000 dollars. So go to accelerator.com and check that out.
John McIntyre: Cool, man. Well, I’ll have a link to that; www.accelerator.com at, uh,
the mcmethod.com. Thanks for coming on the show man.
2 thoughts on “Episode #82 – Jon Benson on Striking People At Their Core and Blasting Your Sales Through The Roof”
Was that 30 min?? Seemed like an instant. Too freaking short! Want more! Thanks though. Such a great intro to rapport building.
Kinda reminded me of Roy H Williams’ capability to make an association between a product or whatever and pretty much any fun/disturbing/catchy fact. Seems like something Jon Benson does a lot as well.
I feel you mate! Jon’s a boss. Had a blast on this podcast.