Episode #165 – Ewen Vile On A 3-Step System For Targeting Your Ideal Customers

by John McIntyre

This episode is experimental.

So bear with us.

New Zealander Ewen Vile has had a recurring direct-response bug throughout his life.

Like a safety axe, business owners call him when their ads are flailing and disaster and chaos is setting in.


Through performing this kind of last-minute consulting, Ewen developed a system.

A system that produced immediate results.

He called it the “ATM” system and now walks groups through it so that they can have their own revelations.

In today’s episode, he walks me (David Allan) through it.

So strap in and watch me become the flailing guinea pig…

as Ewen demonstrates how he finds winning elements for home-run ad copy.

In this episode, you’ll discover:

  • Why 99% of alls ads miss their mark and how to use the “A” of Ewen’s process like a laser-scope.
  • Exactly how Ewen came up with his system. (In stressful situations and inspired by a marketing legend).
  • Put an end to guesswork about who to write to and ferret out all the possibilities.
  • This is his “snuck in the back door” system. Results amidst failing campaigns with panic and chaos setting in.
  • The often-overlooked targets that may produce the greatest returns.

Email Marketing Podcast Episode 152


Intro and outro backing music: Forever More by CREO

David Allan: Hey,everybody – We’re back with another edition of the podcasts. And I’m David Allen. Of course we’ve got a very interesting guest on today and I have no idea how that’s going to go. We’ve already had some technical problems even getting this going so this is one of those things that’s going to get wild it’s going to get crazy. And today I’m talking to a man by the name of you went viral who is basically a shy farm boy who turned to direct response advertising so he could basically avoid manual labor for the rest of his life. And I take great pride in that myself because that’s basically what I wanted to be since I was a kid. I didn’t know direct response advertising would be the vehicle but I knew I wanted to be paid for being smart and clever not for actually doing what people consider real work. So today I would welcome you into the show you and how are you man?

Ewen Vile: Excellent man. I I really smiled when you see her about escaping from that hard life like you know it just brought back memories all of that and it’s just like you know being sort of out of it for so long and you know it’s just like well yeah that’s what it was really like.

David Allan:Yeah. Now you’re about 20 years older than I am…

Ewen Vile: Oh, are we going to get into the age thing… Carry on.

David Allan: And we developed it we talked the other day and sort of came under my radar we talked about Facebook and stuff and then we have a recession. We had a lot in common and sort of hit it off and you told me something that’s very interesting which we’ll get into pretty much right away. But basically how it came up with a system of some kind that you’ve devised a sort of a process I guess that would put people through and maybe you could explain it better than I. Because you have sort of all the nitty gritty details. This is a sort of a proprietary thing or something you figured out. Explain what you’re going to do today.

So what am I gonna do. What am I going to do to you. Is it the company. That’s I haven’t and I have agreed to this so it’s my own doing I guess in a way and it’s also my my possibly my fear in the sense that you know we’ve got no. This isn’t pre. You know and cut and there’s no safety net. Fly by the seat of our pants. Yeah. This one is you know.

You know it is just like this thing and what have you. So it’s great. Yes so what. Know whether they need to be any backstory as to how it sort of came about or we just goes straight straight into it.

Well maybe maybe give a couple of points like you know you sort of told me the other day that you were you know you had a long sort of history of being sort of in and out of advertising and one point you were ran your own ads and then were taking the calls for a weight loss thing and then you’d gone back and forth through different manual labor jobs and there were periods of your life.

But it was always a theme sort of throughout that direct as.

And yes it wasn’t so much of the I mean you know it just made me tenfold in terms of you know where are we going to go today.

And you know take you through the. Is that how that came about. You know the so-called you know my signature or our tree mythology to be able to you know write these winning direct response. That’s right.

So you’ve sort of built up a track record of writing these direct response ads that have raked in some serious money for people and you but you basically come up with a framework in a process so that you can walk people through it often in small groups so that they arrive at the. The big idea themselves I guess.

Yes. Yes. Correct. And so this was just born out of me actually doing consulting of get colder. And we things just go terribly wrong.

And you know on the whole I’ve gone to actually down and sort saying they’ll get paid money upfront just sort out the mess. You know where these datelines And you know just chaos is happening and to me sort things out.

So you see you become kind of a consultant and like where things are going horribly wrong for a business or a campaign didn’t work or you know there’s real havoc you’re kind of that fire x in the box where it says case of emergency break the glass.

Yes. In this case is break break the glass.

Pick up a phone and talk to us.

Yeah yeah. They can be a little bit like that but the other thing too is that we got snuck in the back door and you know they don’t nobody wanted to know that these are the problems. All sorts of things. And you know I just kind of be hashed hash.

So it’s kind of a John Carlton flex I know John Carlat it used to be all right you snuck it in the back door the L.A. ad agencies and put these great you know hooks and stuff in headlines like ads that would crush you.

That’s just it of it’s so interesting and funny. You know it’s just a great kind of a joke for John Karr.

It’s not that I’m not going in the back door that you know these fancy agencies can and silly I have snuck through the side door for London and I say yeah.

Now when you sort of came up with this process this was over a period of time where you sort of assemble the parts and realize these are parts we need.

Or was this a more gradual thing that you know it’s sort of assembled and said you know how did it really come about where you ended up it’s sort of a five step process or something. So how did that really come into where this is.

This is yet it just gradually came to me and you know I’d be kind of interviewing the client as to what’s going on and I don’t know just me was bored with pusley the influence of day in day you know just stay the message of the market match.

Right. That’s media right. Yeah yeah those story.

And so you know I was going into with their idea of what’s going on there. So that was the sayd to it all get cool.

And how many people have you use this stuff with. I know you take small groups of like by people through this tummy or these sort of sessions or whatever you want to call them. Have you had with people.

Yes. In terms of attacking racial groups. So yeah you’re just kind of jumping forward in terms of me actually taking the proceeds that I went through it.

So it has been. Was it about four or five groups and inside groups it’s very small and intimate like five people sort of Max. That seems to be the ideal size that that sort of I didn’t think that I could actually take that because you know you hear the story all the 10000 hours to me up get you know and you know one’s kind of superpowers that you know that are good at doing something that nobody else can do.

You know and you get sort of seduced into believing that a not thing that you can actually transfer it over to other people and that’s kind of a theme I think throughout life in general is that I’ve seen you know anything I’ve endeavored to really learn.

Has this mystique around it of some kind.

It’s often different done in different ways. But yes you know whether it’s playing you know for me personally whether it’s playing guitar or fixing my own car. Of course learning copywriting stuff like learning magic which of course I’m professional magicians.

In other words there’s lots of things around all these different things I’ve endeavored to do and I see them out there for things that other people are desperate to do where they just kind of it’s. It provides a huge wall obstacle almost right off the bat where a lot of people just quit at the very beginning.

Yes yes. You know and it’s just amazing in this day and age. I was in there you know these so many trainings and you know people imparting knowledge you know these shortcuts so that they don’t have to go through all of this. You know it’s finally being broken down I think people looking more and more so in and I think it still can be even done even more so you know it is you know was you just you standing on the shoulders of other giants. Really. You know that’s right.

You never you know you’re not discharging them or anything because you know that they still you know you have full respect for what I’ve done. It wasn’t for them in the first place you know you wouldn’t be we wouldn’t be here we are at now.

Right now it’s true. And so this process basically that you take people through it was born out of your own. Is this the process you were using. Yes.

OK so you did so then you’re kind of like I could actually turn this into something I could get other people to figure it out for themselves.

Yes yes yes. Yes correct. And that was I a couple of incidents occasions where that thing that my goodness other people are picking this up and it’s just like oh my friggin goodness.

It was a Revilla Tory experience.

Yes. Yeah. For me in the same state that these people you know two cases young people have never been written and ad before. You know they’re just young new to the business will pick it up. And even without my intervention or guidance you know just saying like one chap just say I’m sorry to say sort of post and you know that a couple of them together and then just went out and did it and it’s just like and the results just were just you know explosive.

No no I was going to say and do. Have you found these. You know you’ve taken of limit the number of people sort of in these groups through the years in your experience with that process.

You know I often find that I’ve caught a few people different aspects magic things I never really form I give them lessons but I’ve given people some you know some help like kids and stuff or teenagers and stuff. We’re trying very cool you know. And one of the things I sort of learned from doing that you know again very little of it is is that almost there preconceive all that stuff they’ve learned up to that point really hurts them in any way. Right before you know I maybe a new person I would be able to help them get it a lot faster because they don’t have this other stuff. Yeah.

Yes it is isn’t it. And sometimes you’re like usually calling tell me that Dzhokhar is used you know they have to take people through a brain that’s for sure. Right. Who knows. And you know like oh you know it’s just me.

That’s right. You have to escape that stuff out in the car blow it out of your head first. All right. So let’s delve into this because I’m gay.

We’re here to I’m here to get the 49 lashes or whatever they call it and I’m throw myself into the deep end of the pool I want I want to see what you and you know what this whole thing is because I’ve talked with you and here a couple days ago and we set this up the road get on the gas and I’m excited. I’m excited to learn that there’s nothing else in my life. I’m I’m a student of my friend Steve likes to say I’m a student or student of students you know so let’s get down to brass tacks. What’s the what’s the let’s do it.

And so now did we.

You are going to come up with the same money big idea that this young gentleman sold car parts in Jamaica. OK.

OK. So there’s a business that sold car parts in Jamaica. Yes you took them through this process you know before and they came up with this big winning ad through it through this process basically is going to recreate that because I don’t know anything about this.

No. And you don’t possibly know anything about Capossela and I’ve never and I’ve never been to Jamaica.

So we’re three for three.

You don’t need that stuff. That’s it. All right let’s do it.

We stop the car parts business is selling at copouts retile. And so we got to come up with Ray as a force to sell these cab pass now. So he’s a proces. OK then we have to work out who is going to be the audience. You know be speaking to. So who do you think would be the ideal audience. Well the cab pass. Right.

Well since it’s a retail place I assume is consumer so people that are fixing up their own cars I presume now want these car parts.

Who else could be a new audience.

Well I guess garages. Yes.

You know people that are selling them in bulk. Yes. Or use a lot of them in bulk or shoes. So it’s like a bigger bigger market I would imagine. Right.

So when you come up with the Do It Yourself the weekend warrior and then you have the commercial you know this whole wholesale.

So who else could be an audience for anybody that probably sells cars too I imagine.

OK. Yeah. Because those are. Yeah. So say. So there’s another division I’ve tried. OK.

So I imagine like I don’t know maybe they’d fall under one of these categories I’m sure. Like government or somebody too would be OK.

Yes. That’s not as. It’s kind of also kind of thing yes. So the fleet of vehicles. Yeah yeah. So that’s good. But who else in the get get.

Oh you know see if we can do a little bit of a process of elimination for you guess. So when I get in so he’s not going to be doing it. So I’ll try it.

You know like the ones that you mentioned so don’t let you carry on because yes you expanding your thinking of all different audiences you see. That’s the key thing going through the process of thinking of all the different audiences that could be possible.

Right. It’s sort of like a lateral thinking exercise.

Yeah yeah yeah. Just to be able to and when these are a group you know you sort of bouncing around to somebody meeting something and then it just sparks an idea or springboard to something else.

You say wrangling dynamics just really kicks in.

Well I think another another one will be anybody that sells anything related to cars really. So like right.

You know even places like I’m sure like car wash and stuff like that. More of a wholesale deal right.

Yes I hope so.

Yeah but probably also trying to think of a busy time around the like you know maybe don’t sell cars but there’s something else that’s like almost a car. You know you’d cross sell them by somebody something like that maybe.

Right. Yeah you’re thinking so let’s think it it in terms of what would be the baby like carry on like tow truck drivers and stuff like that.

I mean who would be the Who havey uses all of you know like like a mechanic’s place or an auto body place or going on the track of the kind of wholesale who would be heavy users of cars you know because I write all the parts to get to wear out fast wouldn’t I.

Right. That’s right. So. Why has a fleet obviously. Yeah right. Right. So let’s touch on how they’re based the government police. You know tractor trailer companies freight companies. That’s right come next year. Yeah. Well sort of.

Let me just I don’t know if I’m going to get it.

You got to kick yourself when it was your talk. OK.

Taxi drivers are taxi driver Jesus Christ the taxi drivers. It’s been a while since I guess. I guess that would apply to Uber and.

Yeah well that does not in Jamaica.

So this isn’t Jamaican makup I guess it’s been a while since I’ve taken a taxi so I guess it was yeah out of your framework.

But you say this the point you know we’re you’ve got to get out of your own sense of your own world or reality or you know you take yourself outside what you are I was not disappointed this exercise. You’re just getting Stroh you know you think of all the markets all the different things and then you start thinking well you know who’s going to be the ideal. You know what characteristics and who you know started out who the is going to be touring the biggest mileage on the clock.

Taxi Driver Yeah. You say taxi drivers and you know they’re solid operators. So yeah. So that’s the audience. That’s right. That’s great. So in that case. So that was taxi drivers. Yeah yeah.

So now all any any any thoughts are around that know because everybody talks about you know who’s your audience who’s your audience target tag.

And so you know this is an exercise in how to sort of get your think through all the different groups of people.

And that’s when it’s maybe not obvious all the time right.

Yes. We’ve just learned.

So the point you have to you know of the exercise is to go through all the different possible worlds and then you know not not filtering out you know who’s on a guy with all the like the government agencies and you know all of those ones in business you know. So you know that was just exercising the brain. You know it wasn’t so. No no no no. I’ll just let you go you say. Yeah. But so you create that. You know research you say the gears of the brain.

That’s right. They come up with different ideas.

Yeah. So that’s. So anything else would you kind of like to read before we move on. You know we’re learning there.

You know this is a good exercise I think because you know it’s that’s one of the things that sometimes I guess because my it’s not it’s not unlike you know I’ve looked at different clients stuff and tried to fight figured out different ways to like who they could sell to that they’re maybe not doing immediately. And that’s usually a case where it’s like it’s usually a couple of obvious ones. There’s obviously you know other ones I’ve probably missed. Of course in the past too. Because it’s just outside of my personal experience and stuff and you decide to put yourself in other people’s.

Just think of all all through the possible ones and there’s the things you know you have to edit all the ones you have to you know just pick one you know and that can be a bit of a bit of a trauma for yourself. The you know the writer or you know for all you know if you’re you know gun for hire. You know get a new client. Oh no I can’t eliminate all these others.

So he just you know it strikes fear doesn’t it.

So but you really do have to talk to you know when one person who is a representative of a whole group which occurred in St. Louis may die. But they say this this is a real fine.

So that was a lot to the audience.

Yes. This is new territory. You know the timing that nobody seems to do. But it gets to just go straight into it. I did start a demonstration.

All right. And that’s the end of this episode of the method email marketing podcast that was just a small fraction of a much longer interview I did with you and vile. You can actually reach you in down below. The show notes on his Facebook page is where he resides mostly and of course we only covered the day of his 8 a.m. system which is a very sort of intensive walk through of how to come up with ideas from really blockbuster ads that he that he has crafted through his own consulting. If you would like the rest of the interview you can also contact myself Dave

make words pay dotcom and we’ll be back with another edition of the method podcast next week.

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